Forum

A place for reasoned, civil talk about stuff we aren’t supposed to question

You need to log in or register to create posts and topics.

The coming economic crisis

Garland made his now infamous prediction of economic collapse within 18 months which Lee rather pooh poohed. I think you could devote a segment to this as the problem has not gone away. I would like to suggest a guest as well which would be Mitch Fierstein who wrote the book called "Planet Ponzi" and can be contacted via twitter on @planetponzi. He has been on Max Keiser's show on RT. Mitch is an old twitter mate of mine.

Thank you to both Lee and Garland for following me on twitter as you'd know me there as @Big__Kev but I was given a 7 day suspension for saying that Bill Browder was setting himself up for eventually being murdered which is something he has said himself but I had said in previous tweets it would be his so called friends he needed to worry about not Putin.  Well I thought I could see the way this was going so deleted the account with nearly nine thousand follows.

We are in the process of collapse now, but it's the real economy, and the abstract financial economy has not caught up or forced to admit it yet.  Just look at the poverty, austerity, drop in production, infrastructure and investment in future production, real unemployment and private debt levels, wealth disparity, education and worker skills levels, monocrop agriculture with failing GMO technology, climate disruption, trade wars, pollution -- it's almost everywhere in the real world economy.  The financial games and numbers are not sustainable and don't reflect reality.

This is going to way worse than 1929 as at least then the whole world was not riddled with debt.

More people should listen to economist and historian Michael Hudson, about debt jubilee and MMT.  He understands what is happening and what to do about it.

All of the top MMT people, and Steve Keen (who is not exactly MMT), should be seen as those to listen to.

Stephanie Kelton, Bill Black, Randy Wray, Bill Mitchell, Warren Mosler -- the rest at New Economic Perspectives, and also look at Naked Capitalism, and all the heterodox economists, including Rick Wolff. These people should be on the show a few times.

Thing is, we still have a fair bit of real wealth left if the clowns running things and just grabbing up the wealth and money for themselves could be kicked out or made to act sanely and intelligently. And we need to stop wasting all the wealth on these endless evil and absurd wars, as Jack Ma said at the last economic forum.

Good guests for this could include Peter Schiff (pro-gold) and Max Keiser (pro-Bitcoin).

Quote from Jonathan K X on May 24, 2019, 8:15 pm

Good guests for this could include Peter Schiff (pro-gold) and Max Keiser (pro-Bitcoin).

As counterpoint, maybe, but Schiff is an idiot as far as I'm concerned, although Keiser would likely understand the material, although maybe not agree.  I have seen Keen on Keiser's show -- but Keiser is an expert on finance, not economics. Bitcoin is essentially a ponzi scheme and speculative now, and not usable for ordinary transactions, although cryptotechnology could potentially be used to distribute wealth policy horizontally and into the hands of the people -- if the high levels of abstraction could be managed (and the computers could be kept up, with the problem of the massive energy used could be solved).

A problem is that gold is not money, despite what some say, but a commodity which has value now, which is not stable, and which one needs a buyer for. Gold is backed by the so-called 'free market' which is not free and easily manipulated -- no official or government backing. Plus there is not anywhere near enough gold to replace money or account or substitute for all the wealth in the world, which is many trillions in dollar terms.

The other huge problem with gold is that money based on it leads to having no fiscal policy room at all and eliminates fiscal sovereignty of a government -- something which fiat money allows for. Fiat is the way to go, putatively based on the wealth of a nation, if the people in charge are competent and honest. Out problem is the gangsters are neither, and they cheat on gold reserves too. Nothing will work if gangsters are in charge and they are engaged on control fraud.  The important thing to remember is that the tangible is real but money, etc., is only accounting and easy to rig and lie with. Inflation over the decades is not from using fiat but by sneakily transferring wealth from the working class to the plutocrats.

My own thinking looks for solutions involving kicking the entire system up Maslow's Pyramid a few notches, and do some serious planning for increased production using robots and other advanced production technology. Slowly but surely work and production is being decoupled from personal wealth and accumulation, but this can easily take up the next century or two trying to solve the problems in changing over to new paradigms. It's being done badly now, with almost no link between a person being paid well and his actually adding to real wealth and value in the world and society.

 

I too am deeply suspicious of Bitcoin as Satoshi Nakamoto translates from Japanese as "central intelligence" and as for its supposed anonymity that Israeli computer techs proved that they could track payments. Demonetization is of course the globalists agenda as this featured in their house magazine 'The Economist' about 30 years ago. The technology was not available then whereas as it is today. I differ with you about gold as I believe that it is an essential requirement for survival for an individual when the mega crash comes, but it is interesting to see just how many central banks are jumping on the repatriation bandwagon together with the massive increase in purchasing of gold. The Russians buy all the gold mined in Russia and have even now gone on to the open market, although I suspect this is Yuan payments traded for Russian oil which can be traded for gold and is held on account in say Hong Kong. 

While gold is indeed cumbersome to move in large amounts, it is moving West to East at the moment which makes me wonder just how much of it is left in the Gold depositories of Fort Knox and whether an audit might throw up some surprises. Germany had about 50 tons on deposit with the New York Fed and it took several years for these bars to be repatriated and then while the identifiers for each bar married up that the Germans determined that these were not the same bars and also they took the precaution of X-raying them to ascertain whether some of these were tungsten. The Ukrainian Central bank had to admit that it now only had a paltry couple of tons of gold whereas an unmarked aircraft mysteriously spirited the gold out of the country. The same happened in Libya and if the Venezuela coup had proved successful then within hours the same fate would have befallen its gold reserves. The Venezuelan gold held by the Bank of England of course was seized. Gold goes where the economic power resides and America then is a waning empire trading on yesterday's glory of the once mighty US Dollar, but prior to that it was the Pound Sterling. I have doubts whether there can or will be a return to a gold standard of old but neither do I believe that everything will be totally crypotcurrencies either. The current system is drawing to a close which is plain for all to see but I defy anyone to say what comes next.

Trump is accelerating the demise of the USD with his insane trade wars, and who isn't he sanctioning whether it be friend or foe. In uncertainty gold is always a trusted safe haven.